From: Cari Machet (email suppressed)
Date: Sun Oct 28 2007 - 23:09:39 PDT
this only explains part of the process
and really doesn't explain the 3:2 part of the process
there is more to it - interlacing scan lines and repetition/duplication of
film frames
here is a link to a good explanation
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telecine
c
On 10/19/07, Madison Brookshire <email suppressed> wrote:
>
> the following is from
> http://soundrangers.com/html/film-sound.html#timecodechart
>
> "There are two main issues that need to be addressed when transferring
> film to video. The first issue is the fact that film runs at the old
> standard speed which is .1% faster than NTSC color video-the current
> industry standard. Since video's running speed is the industry
> standard, all the synchronization gear in recording studios reference
> this, i.e., run at this speed. This means film usually has to conform
> to this speed in order to work with sound and video in most post
> production studios. The second issue is: film has 24 picture frames
> per second as compared to color video's 29.97 picture frames per
> second. To help deal with these two differences, a transfer process
> known as a 3:2 pull down was developed. During a 3:2 pull down, film
> is slowed down .1% to video speed and the 24 picture frames per second
> of film are converted to video's 29.97 picture frames per second.
> Whenever film is transferred to video, it must go through a 3:2 pull
> down."
>
> Madison
> Los Angeles
>
> > On 10/19/07, redmond entwistle <email suppressed> wrote:
> > > Colorlab in NY were saying that they were having major sync problems
> > > with the increasing number of films that had been shot using solid
> state
> > > recorders. The gist of it seemed to be: no crystal sync, computers are
> > > variable in their operating speeds, even higher end recorders not
> > > delivering stable speeds. This seems like a major concern - if you
> want
> > > sync that is! Does anyone else have thoughts on this?
> > >
> > > Redmond Entwistle
> > >
> > > On Wed, 17 Oct 2007 08:17:54 +0100, "Nicholas Hamlyn"
> > > <email suppressed> said:
> > > > For people of the Nagra generation, the Edirol is a truly
> extraordinary
> > > > cigarette packet-size tool, with an amazingly good stereo mike built
> > > > in. It will record up to two hours of very high quality sound
> (48hz?).
> > > > They cost about $500 US here in the UK.
> > > >
> > > > Nicky Hamlyn.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On 16 Oct 2007, at 20:35, Marcy Saude wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > I have been saving my pennies for the Edirol R-09 (records 24 bit
> WAV
> > > > > or MP3, real small, (well-reviewed, USB 2 and all that- but with
> > > > > stereo mini mic inputs) but I may have to consider this Zoom H-4
> dealy
> > > > > now!
> > > > >
> > > > > If you want tape and don't care about sync, why not pick up a used
> > > > > Sony TCD-5 or early Marantz PMD cassete recorder? They're dirt
> cheap
> > > > > at this point, and were the standard for high-quality music
> bootlegs
> > > > > for quite awhile. Don't call it tape hiss, call it "analog
> warmth."
> > > > >
> > > > > I'd be leery of trusting the archival dependibility of a format
> just
> > > > > because it's "tape" (learned my lesson the hard way with mini dv
> > > > > tapes- luckily the original footage was on film). Whether digital
> > > > > files or tapes, make multiple copies placed in more than one
> location,
> > > > > and resign yourself to semi-regular file/ format migration for as
> long
> > > > > as you'd like your stuff to last.
> > > > >
> > > > > Good
> > > > > luck!
> > > > >
> > > > > -Marcy
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > ************************************************************
> > > > >
> > > > > I use a Sony Hi-MD Walkman MZ-RH1. It is small, lightweight and
> > > > > inexpensive. It can record 16-bit uncompressed audio for an hour
> (per
> > > > > disc) and hooks directly up to my computer via USB. I use a Mac,
> so
> > > > > the files appear on my desktop in WAV format, making them easy to
> use
> > > > > with Final Cut Pro or Protools. If you use a PC, I believe they
> are
> > > > > imported in a different format.
> > > > >
> > > > > If you are concerned about having your media in more than just a
> file
> > > > > format, you can use the disks once and store them, although I do
> not
> > > > > know their shelf life; however, I doubt it is much worse than
> magnetic
> > > > > tape. If money is an issue, you can simply treat the disk as
> though it
> > > > > were a flash card, downloading to your computer and then deleting
> the
> > > > > files off the disk. This is what I do. To the best of my
> knowledge,
> > > > > minidisc is not like mini-DV and multiple uses are
> > > > > acceptable, though
> > > > > I do not know the lifespan on a hi-md disc used in this fashion.
> > > > >
> > > > > Problems: the MZ-RH1 doesn't supply phantom power. It's recording
> > > > > options, such as recording level, are accessed through a menu
> (this
> > > > > will probably be the case for anything small and cheap). 16-bit
> > > > > uncompressed is great, but it ain't 24-bit uncompressed, which
> some
> > > > > flash/hard-drive recorders are capable of. On-site file management
> > > > > (naming, categorizing, etc.) isn't really an option.
> > > > >
> > > > > 4-tracks are great, but the ones I'm familiar with don't really
> meet
> > > > > your qualifications of "light weight and easy to transport." Mine
> > > > > needs to be plugged into the wall, rendering it pretty useless as
> a
> > > > > field recorder.
> > > > >
> > > > > Madison
> > > > > Los Angeles
> > > > >
> > > > > On 10/15/07, Ryan Marino <email suppressed> wrote:
> > > > > > Thanks for all of
> > > > > the links and suggestions, I really appreciate the
> > > > > help.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > What I am ideally looking for is something that I can bring with
> me
> > > > > while I
> > > > > > am out shooting with my bolex. Ultimately everything will end up
> on
> > > > > my
> > > > > > computer so I am looking for something that is somewhat easy to
> hook
> > > > > up to a
> > > > > > computer and import. I mentioned having a preference to tape
> because
> > > > > the
> > > > > > thought of only having material on a disc or hard drive makes me
> > > > > nervous.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Some one mentioned using primitive 4 tracks which I have used in
> the
> > > > > past
> > > > > > and have gotten good results from. The lofi aesthetic is
> something
> > > > > that does
> > > > > > interest me, but I just don't want to feel limited when I feel
> like
> > > > > having
> > > > > > crisp sound and only being able to have sound with tape hiss in
> the
> > > > > > background. I was considering buying a reporters tape recorder,
> a
> > > > > sort of
> > > > > > high end cassette deck that is easy to carry
> > > > > around.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > A Nagra is pretty much out of the question.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > thanks
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > -Ryan Marino
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Michael Wechsler <email suppressed> wrote:
> > > > > > I know it's not tape based, but you may want to check out the
> Zoom
> > > > > H4
> > > > > > recorder. Haven't used it personally, but from what I hear it's
> a
> > > > > > pretty cool little gadget. Records lossless as WAV or compressed
> in
> > > > > > MP3 to removable SD card up to 2GB (WAV records at up to
> 96kHz/24 bit
> > > > > > and everything in between). Though it doesn't have AIFF
> recording
> > > > > > support, that shouldn't really matter because both WAV and AIFF
> are
> > > > > > lossless formats and a Mac can read both. The sound should be
> > > > > > exactly the same aside from a few bits of data in the file
> header.
> > > > > > Other cool
> > > > > features of the H4 are its two built in microphones in an
> > > > > > X/Y crossed pattern to give you stereo recording, a USB
> interface and
> > > > > > its ability to phantom power mics and serve as a USB audio
> interface
> > > > > > on your computer. It's got two hybrid XLR-1/4" jacks and runs
> off
> > > > > > two AA batteries. The product page http://www.samsontech.com/
> > > > > > products/productpage.cfm?prodID=1901 might give you some
> > > > > > more info.
> > > > > > Like I said, I haven't personally used this one, but an
> in-the-know
> > > > > > acquaintance has tested it out and raved about the sound
> quality.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On Oct 14, 2007, at 7:39 PM, Kristine Diekman wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > Hello:
> > > > > > > I use the Marantz recorders with the flash drive. They work
> well,
> > > > > > > but you can only set them to wav or mp3, no aiff. The other
> draw
> > > > > > > back is that they only have xlr inputs, so if you are using a
> > > > > >
> > > > > > stereo mic with dual phone jacks or a stereo mini, you need to
> > > > > > > adapt. I also use a marantz which records to a CD. This is
> really
> > > > > > > my favorite tool, but it is not portable even when it is a
> field
> > > > > > > recorder. Takes both xlr and phone jacks. I take it into the
> field,
> > > > > > > but I would not travel with it. Finally, I also have the
> smallest
> > > > > > > and best tape based sony DAT recorder which I have had
> forever. It
> > > > > > > sounds great, is very easy to use.
> > > > > > > kd
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Kristine Diekman
> > > > > > > Professor, Video
> > > > > > > Art and Technology
> > > > > > > CSUSM
> > > > > > > http://www.csusm.edu/vpa
> > > > > > > http://www.csusm.edu/diekman
> > > > > > > 760-750-4188
> > > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with
> > > > > Yahoo! FareChase.
> > > > >
> > > > > __________________________________________________________________
> For
> > > > > info on FrameWorks, contact Pip Chodorov at <email suppressed>.
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > __________________________________________________________________
> > > > For info on FrameWorks, contact Pip Chodorov at <email suppressed>.
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > __________________________________________________________________
> > > For info on FrameWorks, contact Pip Chodorov at <email suppressed>.
> > >
> >
>
>
> __________________________________________________________________
> For info on FrameWorks, contact Pip Chodorov at <email suppressed>.
>
-- cari machet TV Production Democracy Now! http//www.democracynow.org 917-805-5097 212-431-9090X831 AIM carismachet Skype carimachet - 646-652-6434 __________________________________________________________________ For info on FrameWorks, contact Pip Chodorov at <email suppressed>.