From: Ben Barton (email suppressed)
Date: Fri Apr 24 2009 - 09:00:40 PDT
Hello -
There are different versions of nearly all of Anger's old films - unlike most filmmakers he constantly re-visits and tweaks them!
The two discs brought out a few years ago by Fantoma were just great. They include both versions of Rabbit's Moon.
There are lots of versions of 'Pleasure Dome' - the soundtrack has changed several times - plus there was a three-screen version.
'Puce Moment' has had various soundtracks over the years too.
The only differences I remember in 'Fireworks' are two versions - one with the opening monologue and the other one without, with slightly different opening titles... I seem to remember the VHS version from the 80s being different to the recent Fantoma release. As for Fireworks having "scenes I hadn't seen before" - I have noticed this effect myself. But think it is more to do with the multi-layered nature of this film, rather than different versions of the film itself... I'm sure it's just the titles which change....
Ben Barton
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Freya <email suppressed>
> To: email suppressed
> Subject: Re: Lucifer Rising?
> Date: Fri, 24 Apr 2009 07:27:28 -0700
>
>
> Sorry I've not been able to stay in touch with this thread but I'm
> very busy right now, however I'm amazed to see that there are so
> many different versions of Lucifer rising out there! Lucifer rising
> is one of my favourite if not the favourite kenneth anger movie of
> mine and I would love to see all these versions! I knew the Jimmy
> Page soundtrack was available on a bootleg lp but had no idea it
> was ever actually used in a version of the film. I always thought
> that it was supposed to go with the original Lucifer Rising and
> then years later Kenneth remade it with the new soundtrack after he
> managed to get funding for the new film. Here we can see there is a
> little bit of a continum with the project and it wasn't quite as
> seperated as I had imagined!
>
> From the sound of it there are very different versions of the film
> out ther e and I think it would make for a completely amazing
> Lucifer Rising DVD. A whole DVD just of Lucifer Rising films how
> amazing would that be! Maybe someone here could make it happen. :)
>
> I also found intresting the additional information that only the
> cans marked Bobby were taken and destroyed as that puts a new spin
> on things, that Bobby wanted to destroy his own participation in
> the work rather than destroy Angers work totally. Not that it makes
> much difference but it implies some further motivation or
> rationalisation than I had been led to believe.
>
> As the film is shot in colour I'm really intrested in the idea of a
> hand tinted version! Has anyone here seen any of the versions
> listed below?
>
> Lastly how many other versions are there of Kenneths films? I've
> seen different versions of rabbits moon but does anyone know if
> there are different versions of Fireworks? I know it seems the
> least likely to exist in different versions but I watched a print a
> couple of years ago which seemed to include scenes I hadn't seen
> before! Still wondering if I was imagining it!
>
> Intresting stuff! :)
>
> love
>
> Freya
>
> --- On Fri, 4/24/09, Jack Sargeant <email suppressed> wrote:
>
> > From: Jack Sargeant <email suppressed>
> > Subject: Re: Lucifer Rising?
> > To: email suppressed
> > Date: Friday, April 24, 2009, 3:30 AM
> > Did the BFI have the Jimmy Page
> > version? or is that just in my imagination?
> > Bobby B's soundtrack (the final version) is the better I
> > think.
> > Jack
> > On 24 Apr 2009, at 06:38, Alex Lake wrote:
> >
> > > I know the School of the Art Institute of Chicago has
> > multiple
> > > versions of Lucifer in it's collection, including
> > Anger's workprint.
> > > > They are listed as follows:
> > > Lucifer rising. Chapter one: Magical surprise package
> > from London. 1970.
> > > Lucifer rising. War Department version. 1973.
> > > Lucifer rising. Hand-tinted version. 1973.
> > > Lucifer rising. Jimmy Page soundtrack version. 1973.
> > > Lucifer rising. Work print. 1981.
> > > Lucifer rising. Final definitive version. 1981.
> > > > The listings for the Hand-tinted and the War
> > Department versions note
> > > that the music is Pink Floyd's Atom Heart Mother.
> > > > I have only seen the prints of Magical Surprise
> > Package, which I
> > > cannot remember the sound for, and the Final version
> > with the
> > > Beausoleil soundtrack.
> > > > Hope this is helpful...
> > > > -Alex
> > > > > On Thu, Apr 23, 2009 at 8:54 AM, Ben Barton <email suppressed>
> > wrote:
> > >> Hi Freya -
> > >> >> You are confusing the two productions - yes the
> > first 'Lucifer' did become 'Invocation' - apparently using
> > the outtakes (if you believe that particular Anger yarn!)
> > >> >> But a version of the second film, with the Jimmy
> > Page soundtrack did indeed exist. Anger screened it a few
> > times, i seem to remember. It was incomplete and he screened
> > it to raise more funding.... In fact the bootleg album
> > of Jimmy's soundtrack was ripped from an early print...
> > >> >> Don't know if it is still available though - it's
> > not one of my favourite Anger films, so I have never really
> > tracked that one down.
> > >> >> Ben Barton
> > >> >> >> p.s. While we're on the Anger subject
> > - does anyone know of one of Anger's early (teenage)
> > films - called 'Escape Episode' or 'Demigods'. Some
> > people say it's lost forever - others that Anger indeed has
> > copies - but won't share. Any one know any more?
> > >> >> >> >> >>> ----- Original Message -----
> > >>> From: Freya <email suppressed>
> > >>> To: email suppressed
> > >>> Subject: Re: Lucifer Rising?
> > >>> Date: Thu, 23 Apr 2009 06:37:49 -0700
> > >>> >>> >>> I thought there were never actually prints
> > made because that
> > >>> version of Lucifer Rising was destroyed
> > apparently and supposedly
> > >>> was buried in a hole in the desert according
> > to one of those Anger
> > >>> stories. :)
> > >>> >>> After that Invocation of my demon brother was
> > thrown together from
> > >>> the out-takes and the new Lucifer Rising was a
> > remake! ;)
> > >>> >>> love
> > >>> >>> Freya
> > >>> >>> --- On Thu, 4/23/09, Raymond Salvatore Harmon
> > <email suppressed>
> > wrote:
> > >>> >>>> From: Raymond Salvatore Harmon <email suppressed>
> > >>>> Subject: Lucifer Rising?
> > >>>> To: email suppressed
> > >>>> Date: Thursday, April 23, 2009, 1:56 PM
> > >>>> Hello
> > >>>> >>>> Does anyone know of existing prints
> > available of Kenneth
> > >>>> Anger's original version of Lucifer
> > Rising, with the Jimmy
> > >>>> Page soundtrack? The 1973 version, not the
> > second version
> > >>>> from the 80s.
> > >>>> >>>> Any help is appreciated.
> > >>>> >>>> Yours
> > >>>> >>>> Raymond Salvatore Harmon
> > >>>> raymondharmon.com
> > >>>> >>>>
> > _________________________________________________________________
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> > Chodorov at <email suppressed>.
> > >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>
> > __________________________________________________________________
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> > at <email suppressed>.
> > >> >>> >> >> >> --
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> > >> >> >>
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>
>
>
>
> __________________________________________________________________
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-- It's News. It's Reviews. It's Interviews. It's Free. What Are You Waiting For? www.movieline.com __________________________________________________________________ For info on FrameWorks, contact Pip Chodorov at <email suppressed>.