From: Ken Bawcom (email suppressed)
Date: Tue Jul 11 2006 - 18:15:39 PDT
If I were spending $5,000 on a projector, I would want true HD, which
means 720p, or 1080i, the original HD standards. 1080p is just becoming
available, and will probably be the highest resolution for consumer
equipment, and media, for quite some time. It will show up on Blu-Ray
discs soon. Any true HD projector will up-scale a 480i source, such as
a DVD. Some do a better job than others. I don't see the point in
spending that kind of money on a piece of equipment that would be
down-scaling from some sources. I wouldn't want it for my own viewing,
and certainly not for exhibition. I guess that's the difference between
"HD," and "HD-capable." If you are sure you will never use a source
better than 480i, it might not make any difference to you. But, I think
you'd regret it eventually.
They are already making variations on the HDMI connections, but any
good projector should have this. If it has DVI instead, you can get an
adapter for HDMI.
Ken Bawcom
Quoting Mitsu Hadeishi <email suppressed>:
> Pretty much every theater-oriented projector will accept HD input these days,
> the main issue there is resolution and whether or not it accepts encrypted
> HDMI input (required if you want to use direct digital HD output from
> copy-protected sources). If you're spending $5K you're almost certain to get
> an HD-capable projector. Keep in mind, though, that most projectors don't
> actually have full HD resolution; they're typically scaled down to a somewhat
> lower resolution, so you'd want to find a projector with good scaling
> hardware --- but with a a good scaler the quality of the image remains quite
> stunning (I've watched quite a bit of HD material on these projectors and it
> looks very, very good).
>
> M
>
>
> On Tuesday 11 July 2006 09:34, gyoungblood wrote:
>> How much consideration should one give at this time to things like HD
>> and/or HD capable projectors (I don't know the difference), and the
>> various new input standards, considering that HD TV and DVDs are imminent?
>> I don't want to pay $5K for a projector that will be obsolete or inadequate
>> in a couple of years. I'm talking about a home setup, not for galleries
>> etc. I believe Re-Voir is planning to release an HD DVD of Kenneth Anger.
>> That's something I'd want to project accordingly.
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Mitsu Hadeishi" <email suppressed>
>> To: <email suppressed>
>> Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 8:32 PM
>> Subject: Re: [FRAMEWORKS] video projector for small-ish exhibition space?
>>
>> > If you're comparing DLP to the old LCD projectors, yeah, it's a huge
>> > improvement. But I compared the Panasonic LCD projectors side by side
>> > with a
>> > couple of different DLPs and found the picture quite comparable --- and
>> > in some ways, the LCD picture looks more fluid (perhaps because all LCD
>> > projectors are three-chip projectors, so the picture is totally
>> > continuous,
>> > no switching between colors in a color wheel). But if you're projecting
>> > for
>> > an audience I think a good LCD beats a one-chip DLP, because some people
>> > are
>> > bound to be bothered by the rainbow effect. Three-chip DLPs, of course,
>> > are
>> > great.
>> >
>> > The latest LCD projectors are rated at 2000:1 contrast and up --- which
>> > really
>> > looks fabulous. Old-style LCD projectors were often 400:1 or less and
>> > they
>> > look terrible by comparison...
>> >
>> > Mitsu
>> >
>> > On Monday 10 July 2006 22:03, Ken Bawcom wrote:
>> >> I love DLP, much prefer it to LCD. I have a RP HD DLP monitor, with a
>> >> high speed color wheel, don't move my head much while watching, and
>> >> rarely see the rainbow effect. There is a new version, just showing up
>> >> on the market, that uses LED bulbs, and no color wheel. Even with a
>> >> single chip machine, there is no rainbow effect. Bulb life is greatly
>> >> extended. I don't know if this system is available yet in a projector
>> >> of the size you want, but it would be worth checking for.
>> >>
>> >> Once I thought that most video formats should never be shown on a
>> >> theater-sized screen, because the best projection systems I had seen
>> >> all looked lousy to me, in all respects. Then I saw what a three-chip
>> >> DLP machine could do on a theater-sized screen, with just a DVD, and
>> >> was sold on DLP. Of course, three chip projectors are beyond the
>> >> capacity and price range you are looking at. I admit I haven't seen the
>> >> "latest cinema-oriented LCD projectors." I've also heard good things
>> >> about LCoS, but haven't seen it yet, either.
>> >>
>> >> Ken B.
>> >>
>> >> Quoting Mitsu Hadeishi <email suppressed>:
>> >> > I'll throw in some additional thoughts. I've done a lot of screenings
>> >> > in
>> >> > spaces about the size of what you're discussing, around 1000-2000
>> >> > square
>> >> > feet, with a projection surface of up to 120 inches diagonal. A few
>> >> > thoughts:
>> >> >
>> >> > DLP vs LCD:
>> >> >
>> >> > Like you I much prefer LCD, I hate the rainbow effect. Screen door
>> >> > effect and
>> >> > poor contrast are pretty much a thing of the past with the latest
>> >> > cinema-oriented LCD projectors. My personal preference is for
>> >> > Panasonic
>> >> > brand projectors, they have a very nice look, very fluid, but they do
>> >> > sometimes have some quality control problems with discoloration at the
>> >> > top and bottom of their LCDs.
>> >> >
>> >> > 16x9 vs 4x3:
>> >> >
>> >> > I often project 4x3 format material on a 16x9 projector and it looks
>> >> > fine. Frankly, almost all high-contrast projectors are 16x9, so you'll
>> >> > likely get the best results from the point of view of picture quality
>> >> > from a 16x9 projector. The 4x3 projectors tend to be more designed
>> >> > for office presentations and tend to be bright but have poor contrast
>> >> > and color fidelity.
>> >> >
>> >> > Throw range:
>> >> >
>> >> > My Panasonic is a "short throw" projector which may not be ideal for
>> >> > your
>> >> > needs. You can see throw range and screen size for most projectors on
>> >> > this site: http://www.projectorcentral.com/ which is also an
>> >> > excellent
>> >> > resource for projector reviews.
>> >> >
>> >> > Ambient light:
>> >> >
>> >> > As long as you have no ambient light the fact that the room does not
>> >> > have
>> >> > black walls shouldn't be a big problem.
>> >> >
>> >> > Mitsu
>> >> >
>> >> > On Monday 10 July 2006 18:22, pablo wrote:
>> >> >> Hey,
>> >> >>
>> >> >> I posted on this about a year ago, when I was speculatively shopping
>> >> >> for
>> >> >> a video projector. Things have gone as planned and now I am
>> >> >> definitely planning on buying a projector for exhibition in the next
>> >> >> few months, so
>> >> >> am reposting a few questions to get some more feedback and ideas.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> It will be used in a smallish exhibition setting (20 x 50 room) which
>> >> >> has no ambient light, but does not have black walls, so there is some
>> >> >> bouncing light from the screen itself. The screen is a da-lite
>> >> >> da-mat. We will be using dvcam or beta sp as source material, with
>> >> >> occasional need for laptop input. Primarily though, it will be from
>> >> >> DVcam deck. Most material will be in 4:3. It will all be material
>> >> >> originating/intended to be exhibited on video, not projections of
>> >> >> films
>> >> >> from dvds.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> When I last posted, I had a lot of really good advice from Mitsu
>> >> >> (thanks!) but am looking for some updated advice and experiences with
>> >> >> specific models in a similar setting. I am looking for something in
>> >> >> the
>> >> >> mid-range I guess? Not a cheap-o travel unit, and not a $15k beast.
>> >> >> Maybe in the $3-5k range?
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> 1. dlp vs. lcd.
>> >> >> I hate the rainbow effect. I know some people can't see it but i can
>> >> >> and
>> >> >> it drives me crazy. I have never seen a high end lcd, so am mostly
>> >> >> familiar with screen door effects and weak color/contrast. Does the
>> >> >> faster/seven segment color wheel make a big difference? I know that 3
>> >> >> chip dlps do, but those are way out of price range. On another note,
>> >> >> anyone know anything about LCOS projectors?
>> >> >>
>> >> >> 2. 4:3 or 16:9
>> >> >> As I can expect most people 4:3 material, so it makes sense to stick
>> >> >> with that, though I am finding that the best newer projectors with
>> >> >> the best specs and reviews are all 16:9. Some people say go 16:9 as
>> >> >> it is future proofing, some say stick 4:3 as it does better for both
>> >> >> formats.
>> >> >> What are the drawbacks to using a 16:9 projector for 4:3 material?
>> >> >>
>> >> >> 3. Throw range
>> >> >> Ceiling mount is hard in this space, so ideally i would find
>> >> >> something strong enough and with a lens that would project a 90-96"
>> >> >> high image from about 35-40 feet back. Size of projector itself is
>> >> >> not so important
>> >> >> as we will not be moving this around much. tall order i know, but
>> >> >> throwing that out there.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Any specific ideas or models that might
>> >> >>
>> >> >> thanks
>> >> >> Pablo
>> >> >> Cinema Project
>> >> >> Portland, Ore.
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> __________________________________________________________________
>> >> >> For info on FrameWorks, contact Pip Chodorov at <email suppressed>.
>> >> >
>> >> > __________________________________________________________________
>> >> > For info on FrameWorks, contact Pip Chodorov at <email suppressed>.
>> >>
>> >> "Those who would give up essential liberty
>> >> to purchase a little temporary safety
>> >> deserve neither liberty, nor safety."
>> >> Benjamin Franklin 1775
>> >>
>> >> "I know that the hypnotized never lie... Do ya?"
>> >> Pete Townshend 1971
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> __________________________________________________________________
>> >> For info on FrameWorks, contact Pip Chodorov at <email suppressed>.
>> >
>> > __________________________________________________________________
>> > For info on FrameWorks, contact Pip Chodorov at <email suppressed>.
>>
>> __________________________________________________________________
>> For info on FrameWorks, contact Pip Chodorov at <email suppressed>.
>
>
> __________________________________________________________________
> For info on FrameWorks, contact Pip Chodorov at <email suppressed>.
>
>
>
"Those who would give up essential liberty
to purchase a little temporary safety
deserve neither liberty, nor safety."
Benjamin Franklin 1775
"I know that the hypnotized never lie... Do ya?"
Pete Townshend 1971
__________________________________________________________________
For info on FrameWorks, contact Pip Chodorov at <email suppressed>.